{"id":54136,"date":"2022-11-03T10:14:22","date_gmt":"2022-11-03T17:14:22","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/?p=54136"},"modified":"2022-11-03T10:14:22","modified_gmt":"2022-11-03T17:14:22","slug":"remarks-at-a-u-s-german-futures-forum-moderated-discussion-with-german-foreign-minister-annalena-baerbock","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/?p=54136","title":{"rendered":"Remarks at a U.S.-German Futures Forum Moderated Discussion with German Foreign Minister Annalena Baerbock"},"content":{"rendered":"
11\/03\/2022 12:40 PM EDT<\/div>\n

 <\/p>\n

\n

Antony J. Blinken, Secretary of State<\/p>\n

Munster, Germany<\/p>\n

Atlantic Hotel<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>So impressions from day one, a lot of thoughts, a lot of talking, a lot of thinking going on in these hours yesterday and today.\u00a0 And to delve right into it, welcome please Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Foreign Minister Annalena Baerbock.\u00a0 (Applause.)<\/p>\n

Thank you very much for being here, and we\u2019ll have a few Q&As going back and forth, but we\u2019ll open with a sort of an opening statement from both of you, opening remarks framed in the question, and I\u2019ll start with you Minister Baerbock.\u00a0 We talked about the future of democracy, of course.\u00a0 What future do you see?\u00a0 It\u2019s a broad question but to cover the basis for our democracies in this emerging digital world?<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Well, good morning, good afternoon to everybody.\u00a0 Thanks for this very important conference.\u00a0 It\u2019s a great pleasure to visiting here with my colleague, but already in 11 months and also friend, Tony Blinken, at this panel because we have met in the last ten months already ten times as G7 partners, which shows to answer your question that obviously the future is not as smooth and easy as we have thought maybe a couple of years ago.\u00a0 However, I would say not despite but because of the Russian brutal war against Ukraine, the future is only together because we showed that in this difficult \u2013 and with regarding Ukraine, we have to say horrible current situation \u2013 we can stand only united.<\/p>\n

So I believe that we are really standing at a transatlantic momentum that since February 24th Germany, Europe, and the United States have stood closer together than ever before since the end of the Cold War.\u00a0 And we are firmly united not only in the support of Ukraine and the people and the freedom, but that this transatlantic moment besides all the horror comes with great opportunities.\u00a0 Because I\u2019ve been grown up here in Germany for 40 years of my life, living always in peace, and we had so many debates in Europe \u2013 and I know that you have this also in the U.S. \u2013 that everybody took peace just for granted, as if the European peace order just falls from the sky and that it was there and people were arguing so actually why do we need the European Union, why do we need the transatlantic relation.<\/p>\n

And now we know why: because the European Union, the transatlantic partnership, the transatlantic friendship is our insurance for life in peace and in a more democracy where we can live freely as we want.\u00a0 And therefore to build an even stronger transatlantic relationship for the 21st century is, I believe, the main task of the two of us as foreign ministers, the main task for our governments, and the main task for all of our citizens.\u00a0 Because we can address the global challenges only together, but as we are talking about a digitalized world today, we always have to speak also that the European peace order, that the international peace order is not only being attacked by bombs and missiles, but obviously also being attacked by disinformation, fake news, a systematic rival or even war against our democracies.\u00a0 And it has been shaped by attacks with SPITs and (inaudible), with bots, and the source of technical power.<\/p>\n

So yes, the digital revolution has brought us more freedoms to millions of people.\u00a0 We see this as we can see today in Iran with the brave women in Iran that the internet is a source not only of information but also spreading their fight for freedom around the world.\u00a0 But even in our societies, we can see that the digitalization is also importing for people who do not have access \u2013 for example, if we\u2019re talking to a total different field, bank accounts.\u00a0 You have some regulation when you can open a bank account even in democracies, even in social welfare states, you have to have some certain account of income.\u00a0 But if you have now a smart phone, you can transfer also money digital-wise without having a bank account.\u00a0 So I think this shows how actually it has brought freedom to us.<\/p>\n

And I came just back from Uzbekistan, and there wasn\u2019t \u2013 it was with a group of people from 11th grade, and they were discussing about the positioning of their country with regard to Russia, complaining that in the official media there is so much Russian narrative going on.\u00a0 But they inform themselves, they said, anyhow only via social media, via Telegram, via Facebook, via Twitter.\u00a0 So we can see that the digital revolution has been also a moment for freedom and for strengthening our democracy.<\/p>\n

But obviously this is no news.\u00a0 Everybody knows that the digital world also comes with risk for security and threatens our freedom.\u00a0 And to answer your question with three points \u2013 and I was asked for the input to go a bit into a detail \u2013 I think we have three points where we should \u2013 I\u2019d intensive our cooperations, especially with regard to a digitalized world and the threat to our democracies.<\/p>\n

First of all, we have to make sure that digital technologies are used for and not against people.\u00a0 And that makes our democracies stronger and not weaker.\u00a0 And this is also a message for democracies in progress or on the road to progress to underline to governments, like in Central Asia, of saying if you try to regulate or ban your internet, this doesn\u2019t make your government and definitely not your societies stronger but weaker, because digital technologies have to be used for the peoples.<\/p>\n

And the U.S. has put this very prominently in the recent U.S. National Security Strategy, and we will \u2013 as many of you know \u2013 write also a national security Germany for the first time in Germany history where we take on this point by three points.\u00a0 First of all, we address the challenges in the digitalized world, underlining that with regard to using digitalized democracy for the people and not against the people to have an open and safe cyberspace.\u00a0 In Germany, we have had the attacks in our election in 2016 very happily \u2013 heavily.\u00a0 We have had the situation that emergency part of one of our hospitals had to close down because of a cyber attack.\u00a0 You had in the U.S. most recently the largest airports being targeted.\u00a0 And in Montenegro and Albania, while we were at the General Assembly in New York, hackers paralyzed their entire economies.\u00a0 And we see \u2013 and again now in Russia \u2013 how much this attack on infrastructure has been using as a weapon of war.<\/p>\n

Europe and the U.S. are responding to threats on all levels.\u00a0 We go after cyber criminals, for example, by blocking cryptocurrency payments.\u00a0 But also \u2013 and this is a new momentum in this difficult time of war \u2013 we are working on a virtual rapid response teams within NATO to ensure that our infrastructure, which is obviously connected virtually with trains, airports, or hospitals, can be better protected with regard to hackers and other attacks.<\/p>\n

Second, we are fighting intensively with regards to the spread of disinformation.\u00a0 This is also not the big news, but in this critical moment of the last eight months we have been showing, I believe quite successfully, what a difference it makes if we are working together.\u00a0 In the beginning of the war, we knew in theory that fake news is a form of instrument of this war method.\u00a0 But then when you remember the situation of the sanctions and the grain, we didn\u2019t have it \u2013 I have to say we have to be so frank and open also in our debates and when we\u2019re at G7 meeting back in Schleswig-Holstein, we were faced with a situation where suddenly the whole world was speaking about sanctions and that this would be hitting also the prices of food.\u00a0 So obviously, while we were passing the sanction, we didn\u2019t think ahead enough of underlining what could be the fake news counterattack by Russia \u2013 not fighting the sanctions, but fighting the narrative of the sanction.<\/p>\n

And so we had to speed up, and I think this G7 meeting \u2013 it was so successful because at this meeting we made very clear because we spoke openly about it that this is a method of warfare using fake news also as an instrument of war, and that food has been using by Russia as an instrument war.\u00a0 We\u2019re speaking about the war of food.\u00a0 Immediately afterwards, there came the counterattack from the Russians, and this is why I go so much into depth, because it\u2019s not only about what say at G7 meetings; it\u2019s a question for all our open society.\u00a0 There was a back attack from the Russians saying how whatever I am, and at this critical moment there was some headlines in German media just taking over this quote.\u00a0 But in a headline you don\u2019t know what the quote is from \u2013 was it from me, was it Tony Blinken saying, well, this young lady is obviously not well informed, or if it\u2019s the Russian spokesperson.<\/p>\n

And I think this is very important that we must be speaking about countering fake narratives.\u00a0 Everybody says yes.\u00a0 But in a time of war, what is the responsibility also of the media itself with regards to these fake news?\u00a0 Because obviously, media reports what people are saying.\u00a0 So that is our second point with regard to fighting the spread of disinformation and undermining obviously democracies in these kind of times.<\/p>\n

And also with this point, I think we shouldn\u2019t be shy of our strongest tools as democracy.\u00a0 One of our strongest tool is the rule of law, so we should use the rule of law.\u00a0 And this is not to fight freedom, also not in the internet a regulated platform with rights and rules is something normal in societies because every freedom has also limits when you counter the freedom or hurt the freedom of another person.\u00a0 So by regulating social media platforms to counter criminal content and hate speech on a regulated, normative base, and working together in this regard, the \u2013 you will do so with the Digital Services Act, and this is also one of the parts where we can work closely together.<\/p>\n

And my third point is investing in key technologies in the digital age.\u00a0 Obviously, artificial intelligence, quantum computing, and semiconductors, and 6G, this is the future.\u00a0 And the technology leadership will be crucial for security.\u00a0 In the EU we are investing in standard setting and the development of key technologies with the EU Data Act, with the European Chips Acts.\u00a0 We are making sure that new technology work in a way reflecting our values.\u00a0 But obviously, again, the power comes only if we are working together, because in this part this is not only Russia but also other players in the world which go with heavy, heavy weight but also money in this question.<\/p>\n

Yes, the U.S. and the EU, we are also competitors \u2013 also competitors in the digitalized world.\u00a0 And I think we have to speak openly about this that we are competitors, but with regard to this crucial key technologies where we are also in competition with countries worldwide which challenge our democracy, we have to talk about how we can work closer together, bringing together our intelligence.\u00a0 And I think the EU-U.S. Trade and Technology Council will be one of the most powerful instruments if we use it jointly together to join hands across the Atlantic with regard to key technologies.\u00a0 The council has already led us to coordinate more closely on standards, on supply chains, on export control and investment screening, and now we have to get even closer in daily reality with this regard.<\/p>\n

I have to say very frank and open the work program on this is so ambitious that we cannot do it alone, definitely not the two of us.\u00a0 Well, obviously I\u2019m not the most experienced expert on future technologies.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know about you, but I tried programming some technology path at some university. It was better that others were doing it.\u00a0 But also with regard to our governments, with regard to our democracies, we can face this and I would say digital attack on our democracies only together.\u00a0 This is not only a job for ministers and politicians and not only a job for digital companies.\u00a0 We can be successful only if we work together with researchers, with entrepreneurs, with young people who do have an incredible expertise and innovative ideas.\u00a0 And this is also why we are here today not only with those who come always together at this transatlantic momentum, but with young peoples together.\u00a0 This is why we have the U.S.\u2011German Future Forum bringing together people, closely listening to your ideas in the forum but also afterwards when you present your proposals with strengthening our democracies and to show that also you, societies, are standing united together with facing this harsh winter.<\/p>\n

Because in the end, coming back to where we are standing in November 2022, Putin is bombing Ukraine \u2013 not only cities, not only power plants, but infrastructure.\u00a0 We have been just coming out of a bilateral.\u00a0 We have been talking of what the winter will mean.\u00a0 It means electricity in the country being blocked at the moment about 30, 40 percent, but if this keeps going on children will not only hide under their table because they hear the bomb attacks, but they are in danger of being frozen to death because they don\u2019t have any electricity and any heating anymore.<\/p>\n

And therefore our mandate is so crystal clear.\u00a0 We have to seize this transatlantic moment together.\u00a0 United as democracies we are stronger than this war, and I think this is actually the most important message we have to send today from this panel.\u00a0 So thank you for this day and the work you did yesterday.\u00a0 (Applause.)<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Thank you very much, Foreign Minister Baerbock, outlining, stressing the importance of the transatlantic relationship in this day and age.\u00a0 Secretary Blinken, I would assume that you concur with a lot of points that Foreign Minister Baerbock made, but the future of democracy in the digital world \u2013 does America, does the United States, have a different take and a different approach?\u00a0 Or how do you see it?\u00a0 And what are your concrete steps that the U.S. is undertaking in achieving that?<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, first let me say it\u2019s wonderful to be here with each and every one of you, and Ingo, thank you for moderating.\u00a0 I will want to thank Bertelsmann also for supporting this and bringing us together.\u00a0 But it\u2019s especially good to be with my colleague and my friend, Annalena.\u00a0 We have been working incredibly closely together, as befits representatives of two countries that are and have to be working even more closely together precisely if we\u2019re going to meet the challenges.<\/p>\n

I have to say I am in violent agreement with everything that Annalena said.\u00a0 (Laughter.)\u00a0 Which is not unusual at all.\u00a0 On the contrary.\u00a0 But let me just put it this way, and I\u2019ll add quickly a couple of thoughts that are totally coincident with what Annalena said.<\/p>\n

We\u2019re at an inflection point in history.\u00a0 The post Cold War era is over.\u00a0 There is a competition on now to shape what comes next, and technology is at the heart of that competition.\u00a0 One way or another it is going to retool our economies, it\u2019s going to reform our militaries, it\u2019s going to quite literally reshape our lives, as we know every day from the phones that we carry in our \u2013 the computers that we carry in our pockets.\u00a0 And we know the profound effects that\u2019s having on our lives.<\/p>\n

Germany and the United States together have a very positive, affirmative vision for what that reshaping looks like.\u00a0 It\u2019s about finding new ways to cure diseases.\u00a0 It\u2019s about using technology to make sure that we can actually deal with climate change.\u00a0 It\u2019s about using technology to make sure that we can have our societies and economies powered in ways that don\u2019t rely on fossil fuels.\u00a0 It\u2019s about making sure that we have sustainable, healthy supplies of food around the world.\u00a0 It\u2019s about finding ways to have truly resilient supply chains.\u00a0 And ultimately, it\u2019s also about making sure that we have good jobs for our people for the future.\u00a0 And there are challenges inherent in each of those.<\/p>\n

But as Annalena said, and as you all know and as you\u2019ve been talking about not just today but over many days, we also know that technology can be profoundly misused.\u00a0 And I thought the way that Annalena put it is exactly right.\u00a0 It has to be for people, not used against them.\u00a0 But it is being used against them.\u00a0 It\u2019s being used against them in different ways to undermine their privacy, to repress their human rights, to quite literally harass people online, particularly women and minorities, as we see around the world.\u00a0 It\u2019s used profoundly for misinformation and disinformation, which is, along with corruption, I think the two most corrosive things of any democracy.\u00a0 And of course, there are profound questions of security that we\u2019re responsible for and others are responsible for where technology can be used for ill, including cyber attacks on infrastructure.<\/p>\n

The fundamental point that Annalena made that I strongly, strongly agree with is that in order both to capture the upsides of technology but also to deal with the downsides there is a number one imperative in working together.\u00a0 No single country \u2013 whether it\u2019s the United States, whether it\u2019s Germany \u2013 can actually effectively meet these challenges alone.\u00a0 There\u2019s a premium, more than at any time since I\u2019ve been engaged in these issues \u2013 and it\u2019s now coming on 30 years \u2013 for finding ways to cooperate, to coordinate.\u00a0 And that is no more true than when it comes to technology, when it comes to the digital world we\u2019re living in.<\/p>\n

Annalena talked about the work that we\u2019re doing together to try to set standards, to put in place the rules for how technology is used.\u00a0 That is more important than ever.\u00a0 To the extent that values infuse technology, we want to make sure that the values that we stand for together, the United States and Germany, carry the day.\u00a0 And that means doing the hard work, the day-in, day-out work of being at the table and making sure that we\u2019re there in the first place and that we\u2019re coordinated in doing so, in shaping those rules.<\/p>\n

It also means together trying to establish a race to the top, not to the bottom, when it comes to the way technology is deployed, the way it\u2019s used.\u00a0 And if we\u2019re successful in doing that, then those countries that may now be engaged in a race to the bottom will have a choice to make, whether actually to join us in this race to the top or probably over time fail, if we get it right.<\/p>\n

But all of this starts with the coordination.\u00a0 All of this starts with the work that we do together.\u00a0 And there I have to say one of the things that I\u2019ve been most grateful for, the United States has been most grateful for, is this partnership with Germany and in particular in my case the partnership with and the leadership of the German foreign minister.<\/p>\n

Over the past year, this has been quite extraordinary.\u00a0 We\u2019ve, as you\u2019ve heard, met many times through the work of the G7 but also together on a bilateral basis, in other groupings that we\u2019re a part of.\u00a0 And so much of this is about the leadership that she\u2019s bringing to these issues every single day.\u00a0 It\u2019s made a huge difference in our ability to tackle these problems.<\/p>\n

But fundamentally, we have all of these tensions between what we stand for as democracies and how technology fits into that.\u00a0 It either advances our democracies or undermines them.\u00a0 We\u2019re each living that every single day.<\/p>\n

When I was growing up, the thinkers that I was influenced by were many of the classic social thinkers of centuries past, like John Stuart Mill.\u00a0 And the basic concept that John Stuart Mill had was that we\u2019re engaged in a marketplace of ideas, and if we have a marketplace that functions properly the best ideas will compete against each other and ultimately the best idea will prevail.\u00a0 It\u2019s a wonderful vision.\u00a0 It\u2019s not the reality that we\u2019re living, precisely because technology, when its misused, is distorting the marketplace.<\/p>\n

We have to find ways together \u2013 and by together I mean exactly what Annalena said.\u00a0 It\u2019s not just between governments.\u00a0 It can\u2019t be.\u00a0 Civil society, NGOs, the private sector, academia \u2013 all of us actually have to join hands and be on the same team.\u00a0 One of the things that\u2019s changed most profoundly in the time that I\u2019ve been working in government is in the information and digital space.\u00a0 And again, we\u2019ve \u2013 the way we\u2019re thinking about this has evolved dramatically.<\/p>\n

When I started out in government 30 years ago, two things happened every day.\u00a0 The same two things happened every day in the White House, where I was working.\u00a0 People would get up in the morning, they would open the front door of their apartment or their house, and they\u2019d pick up a hard copy of the newspaper \u2013 in our case\u00a0The New York Times,<\/em>\u00a0or\u00a0The Washington Post<\/em>, or\u00a0The Wall Street Journal<\/em>.\u00a0 And then if you had a television in your office, in our \u2013 at 6:30 at night you would turn on the national news.\u00a0 And that was it.\u00a0 That was the common denominator for everyone.<\/p>\n

Now we\u2019ve had a vast democratization of information technology, which again we think is probably for the good.\u00a0 Except we know that it\u2019s also created an absolute free-for-all, an almost \u2013 an information jungle in which sometimes, unfortunately, might makes right; the loudest voices prevail, even if what they\u2019re saying is not \u2013 does not reflect reality.\u00a0 None of us are going to be able to get a grip on that problem if we\u2019re acting alone, whether \u2013 governments can\u2019t do it alone; the private sector is unlikely to do it alone; NGOs may have the right ideas, but all of this needs to be brought to bear.<\/p>\n

So one of the reasons I\u2019m so glad that you\u2019re all together, that we\u2019re all together, is to see if we can find new ways to work across our different enterprises.\u00a0 That\u2019s the only way we\u2019re going to get to it.<\/p>\n

Finally, I\u2019ll say this.\u00a0 It\u2019s really fitting that we\u2019re here, and I thank Annalena for inviting us here to M\u00fcnster for the G7, but also for this meeting.\u00a0 Of course, the Peace of Westphalia put in place fundamental principles of international relations that are the very principles that are being challenged today by Russia when it comes to Ukraine, and that is the territorial integrity and the sovereignty of nations.\u00a0 If we let that be challenged with impunity, then the foundations of the international order, they\u2019ll start to erode and eventually crumble.\u00a0 And none of us can afford to let that happen.<\/p>\n

The other thing that\u2019s striking about this place is it was part of something called the Hanseatic\u00a0 League back in the 14th and 15th century, an effort to literally create trading routes in what is now Germany and throughout the \u2013 throughout Europe, connecting people, connecting products, connecting ideas.\u00a0 And at its best, that\u2019s also what the digital world is about.\u00a0 Our challenge is to somehow make sure that it lives up to its best, not its worst.<\/p>\n

Technology is neither inherently good nor bad.\u00a0 What we make of it is, and that\u2019s our challenge together.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Thank you, Secretary Blinken.\u00a0 (Applause.)\u00a0 Both of you actually touched upon a couple of questions that I already had and covered already, so let\u2019s go into a little more detail on some of these fields.<\/p>\n

But you both outlined the perils and the advantages, of course, that technology has, but also the danger, the tools it gives authoritarian governments and regimes and also the opportunities for fake news that exist.\u00a0 Would you say that there\u2019s been a bit of a disenchantment with social media, with digital opportunities, and that if you sum it up the negative somehow outweigh the benefits?<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 Please.\u00a0 (Laughter.)<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well \u2014<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Because it seems to me that so many challenges \u2013<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:<\/strong>\u00a0 No.\u00a0 My short answer is no.\u00a0 Well, and this counts actually for everything.\u00a0 I think if you\u2019re in politics and think the glass is half empty, you shouldn\u2019t be there.\u00a0 I mean, then you\u2019ve given up anyhow.\u00a0 And this counts for me and also for the digitalized world, but I think all of the facts are on this side, and not only because I want to believe in a better future.\u00a0 Because yes, obviously we have the fake news, we have everything we were mentioning, and Tony was outlining perfectly what the challenges are there.<\/p>\n

But if you look around the world, well unfortunately, with regard to our sustainable goal, the SDGs from the United Nations, we are not there where we wanted to be.\u00a0 With poverty, we were on a good track, and then the Russian war came.<\/p>\n

But with regard to education for example, when you travel around the world \u2013 thanks God also to other countries and not only to the countries you know anyhow \u2013 when I\u2019ve been in Niger, for example, the president said, which I didn\u2019t hear before from a male president, my most important topic is education and reproductive rights.\u00a0 So because he couldn\u2019t counter the explosion of the birth rate, he didn\u2019t have so many schools, teachers, whatsoever, and he knew that if he cannot handle this kind of situation, the radicalization, the whole security, threat of terrorists will just explode.<\/p>\n

So while he didn\u2019t have any school building, while obviously Niger is like on this part of the development track from all countries in the world, even there the question of digitalization \u2013 yeah \u2013 in those parts where they do have electricity, where they do have digital platforms, he even was speaking about okay, if I don\u2019t have a school building, I don\u2019t have teachers, but I have the opportunity of the internet.<\/p>\n

Then all the situation where the media is oppressed in all these kind of countries, how young people inform themselves, how you give a platform for those who are not being employed in different parts.\u00a0 So I think the opportunities are way bigger than the threat.\u00a0 However, this is \u2013 the difficult part of the story, as Tony was saying, it\u2019s not the best argument which sometimes come through but the one who\u2019s the loudest person.\u00a0 So we have to join forces to fight the bad side of the digitalization.\u00a0 And if we are getting better in this, because obviously we are not there yet, I think this will be \u2013 give even more chances to all the societies worldwide.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 How does that shape your policy-making?<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yeah.\u00a0 Well, first, let me I say I very much agree.\u00a0 Despite all of these challenges, I remain fundamentally optimistic, including optimistic about technology writ large but also the digital space more specifically.\u00a0 And I think if you do the balance, I still think it comes out with the glass half full.<\/p>\n

The progress that we\u2019ve been able to achieve and actually achieve in people\u2019s lives is dramatic.\u00a0 It\u2019s easy to take for granted; it\u2019s easy to lose sight of.\u00a0 But it\u2019s real and I think it\u2019ll continue, including in the social media space, in terms of our ability to connect people, to connect ideas, to connect products.\u00a0 All of that is real.<\/p>\n

But one of the hallmarks that we know of every major transformation, technological transformation throughout our history, is that there are all sorts of unintended consequences, and they often race forward much more quickly than governments or other regulators of one kind or another are able to capture them.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 So the question is:\u00a0 Can we be fast enough?<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 So this is a big part of our challenge.\u00a0 It\u2019s \u2013 and again, this comes back to the point that we were both making about the imperative of finding ways to work together not just between governments, but among the different stakeholders.\u00a0 Because we don\u2019t have \u2013 in our case, we often don\u2019t have the resident expertise or knowledge we need to be closely aligned with business, with civil society, with academia.\u00a0 The more we find ways to do that, I think the quicker we\u2019ll actually be in managing to deal with \u2013 first of all, not only deal with; the whole idea \u2013 and Annalena mentioned this \u2013 is to get ahead of it.\u00a0 We have to be able to better imagine what the unintended consequences may be, and try to factor that in.<\/p>\n

I think if you were talking to those who were at the founding, present at the creation of social media, they had an extraordinary vision of all the good and positive that can flow from that.\u00a0 I\u2019m not sure how much time they spent thinking about \u201cbut what if.\u201d\u00a0 So part of our challenge is actually to imagine \u201cwhat if\u201d and to try to build in some guardrails against that.\u00a0 Now the problem is we\u2019re doing that while the plane is flying at 60,000 feet.\u00a0 That\u2019s hard.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s the harder part.\u00a0 Which leads me, actually, to a question \u2013 to an idea I just had.\u00a0 When you recruit future diplomats for the (inaudible) under the State Department, do you actually make that a requirement, a certain tech savviness, or a certain \u2013 that you can hit the ground running in this fight?<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 (Laughter.)\u00a0 So I\u2019m happy to start on this because it\u2019s something that\u2019s actually a bit fascinating.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Or recruit here in this audience.\u00a0 I mean, I\u2019m sure there \u2013 (laughter).<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 Actually, please, there\u2019s a table \u2013 (laughter).<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Just drop your business card.<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 So let me \u2013 I got to the point when I last served in government in the Obama administration, where I\u2019d be in these rooms that we\u2019re so familiar with, without windows, where we\u2019re having policy deliberations with our teams, and I became convinced that virtually all of the things we were working on, somewhere as part of the answer had technology, science, innovation.\u00a0 Maybe not the totality of the answer, but a part of it.\u00a0 And the problem for many of us in these jobs \u2013 at least I\u2019ll speak for myself \u2013 is we\u2019re not trained in these disciplines.\u00a0 Most of us come up through the humanities.\u00a0 And as a result, I got to the point where I thought that I needed a scientist or technologist at the table just to tell me whether I needed a scientist or technologist at the table to understand, oh, this problem may have a solution that\u2019s grounded in science and technology.<\/p>\n

So fast forward.\u00a0 We are making a major effort right now at the State Department to do just that, to make sure that we have that talent in the department, both in terms of who we recruit, who we bring in to advise us, and how we grow that talent from within the department.\u00a0 We established just a few months ago a new bureau.\u00a0 The bureaus are the founding, are basically the building blocks of our entire department.\u00a0 We now have a new bureau for cyberspace and digital policy to make sure that we\u2019re able to not only understand but lead around the world in the efforts that we\u2019re engaged in together when it comes to how cyberspace is regulated, what digital policy should be.\u00a0 And a big part of that is making sure that we have the people to do it.<\/p>\n

So the short answer is we want to make sure that everyone is at least basically literate in technology, hopefully fluent, and eventually truly expert.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Ideally, yeah.\u00a0 Do you want to add something?\u00a0 Or otherwise I would ask you, if you have the people that implement those policies, there\u2019s also the aspect of the technology that you need, for example.\u00a0 We see what\u2019s happening in Iran or in other countries, where it\u2019s \u2013or Uzbekistan, you mentioned the example as being limited.\u00a0 What\u2019s happening on that field, on that level?\u00a0 Have we reached those?<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, if I may, can I go back to the people?<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yeah.<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:<\/strong>\u00a0 Because again, here we have to be frank and open.\u00a0 No, we don\u2019t have the capabilities, especially with regard to the people.\u00a0 I was talking about birth rate.\u00a0 I mean, if we are looking anyhow with regard to people in the working space, we have big challenges, and then especially in this field.\u00a0 And I think this is something \u2013 because we talk about leadership, U.S., Germany \u2013 in many fields, yes, we do have the leadership.\u00a0 In other fields, at least for my country, I have to say we have to learn from other countries.\u00a0 And this is a great job of foreign ministers; you don\u2019t go there, at least this is my understanding, and to preach how great your own country is.\u00a0 I mean, you can say, well, we tried this and it worked quite well.<\/p>\n

But so many things I\u2019ve learned, now also in the time of war from Ukraine, I went there to there.\u00a0 Ministry of Information \u2013 and it has a different name, and I forgot, because when I entered the building I always ask my team, \u201cAre you\u2019re sure we\u2019re in the right building,\u201d yeah?\u00a0 Because it looked like a start-up company.\u00a0 Then we entered a room where the average age was way lower than here, even though we invited here our young people, and we think we\u2019re really advanced that we invited young people to a conference.\u00a0 (Laughter.)\u00a0 But there they not only invited, but employed people which were, I would guess, 18 years old, directly obviously from the street.<\/p>\n

Now, they were well educated people, but I mean, if I would go to my ministry and even suggest we should employ maybe not only diplomats and not only lawyers, and what Tony was mentioning, we should think also about IT expert.\u00a0 This is kind of a revolution already, because in our bureaucracy, then it\u2019s really difficult to say that they don\u2019t have to rotate and all these kind of things.\u00a0 But if I would come up and say you know what, forget about education, university, diploma; I have heard from a great guy in the Chaos Computer Club and I think he\u2019s the best answer to our fake news strategy, while the challenges and feminist foreign policy is an easy pass I would say if I compare it to this.<\/p>\n

So without any joke, I think this is what other countries are well in advance, especially those countries now with Ukraine fighting a war of disinformation, but also Baltic states, other countries around the world, where they just jumped over some centuries between the phone and the iPhone, and they are directly now in the digitalized world.\u00a0 And this is really something where we have to work on with people, but also with technologies.<\/p>\n

And therefore I would like to take up one of the proposals which we just heard in the video: your proposal of an establishment of an intergovernmental standardization body to ensure the interoperability between public and private software.\u00a0 I wrote it down to don\u2019t do any mistakes and have another fake news video somewhere.\u00a0 In the U.S. and Germany, this was a proposal from you, but we in our national security strategy \u2013 which is not published yet, but \u2013 our first point is to have interoperability between our ministries, yeah, in the government and between the local, federal, and then the European level.\u00a0 Because this is already the challenge, that we use different software.<\/p>\n

So now we all know it, so I think we are very quick on this, so we can take this proposal just onboard to also have this possibility between the U.S. and the European Union.\u00a0 And this would answer also your question.\u00a0 We are not there yet, but we know the way how we can go together to join forces again, and to understand standard-setting.\u00a0 This was a great example, I think, you were giving.\u00a0 We have learned that obviously through (in German) \u2014<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Trade, yeah.<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u2014 so trade; it sounds nice in the German language \u2013 trade doesn\u2019t bring automatically change, so we have learned this now.\u00a0 But you have mentioned, I think, very perfectly also that not only the ideas are there, but we have to all support standardization.\u00a0 And this is also new thinking maybe even more for the U.S. than in Germany, because we love regulation.\u00a0 (Laughter.)\u00a0 But anyhow, to understand that this is a good thing for democracies, because you can also counter fake news.\u00a0 But also if we are thinking about the \u2013 about a satellite, yeah, so if we don\u2019t have regulated the aerospace in this regard and if we don\u2019t have the standardization \u2013 and then it come also, thanks God, back to diplomats, lawyers in foreign ministries, because drafting these kinds of treaties is crucial in the end and will be, I think, the way forward.<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>And despite Shakespeare, there\u2019ll always be room for lawyers.\u00a0 (Laughter.)<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>All right, and there\u2019s not much room for questions left.\u00a0 So I would like to actually pitch it to the audience, and we gathered a few questions.\u00a0 And the first one is from Heather Thompson, if you would please stand up and just \u2013 we don\u2019t have a lot of time because we also want to take a picture with all of you \u2014<\/p>\n

QUESTION:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Sure.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>\u2014 so if you could keep it brief.<\/p>\n

QUESTION:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Hi, thank you. It\u2019s a pleasure to be here.\u00a0 My name is Heather Thompson.\u00a0 I am an American, but I work in German civil society now for a nonprofit called Democracy Reporting International.\u00a0 My question is about digital foreign policy.\u00a0 I believe it\u2019s a vital part of our response to disinformation, digital inclusion, and online human rights.\u00a0 I\u2019m wondering, how can the U.S. and Germany work better together to strengthen our digital foreign policy and combat these threats online?\u00a0 Thank you.<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Well, just very quickly, I think one of the things that we\u2019ve both been spending a lot of time on is building the structures, the organizations to do exactly that, precisely because, like you, we\u2019ve identified this as a critical necessity and a critical challenge. Annalena mentioned something that was established between the United States and the European Union, the Trade and Technology Council.\u00a0 A big part of the work of the council is exactly what you just described, to actually have an aligned \u2013 to the greatest extent possible \u2013 approach to digital policy.<\/p>\n

Annalena said as well we\u2019re competing in ways, too; we have to recognize that and also not be shy about that.\u00a0 Competition is good as long as it is pursuant to agreed rules, and ideally as long as, as I said, it\u2019s a race to the top, not the bottom.\u00a0 But what we\u2019re doing with the TTC is exactly that.\u00a0 We\u2019re trying to align our digital policies in a whole variety of ways, particularly when it comes to trying to establish the norms, the rules, the standards by which all sorts of critical technology is used, whether it\u2019s AI, whether it\u2019s quantum \u2013 lots of discussions, of course, about 5G and what comes next \u2013 et cetera.<\/p>\n

So we\u2019re doing that.\u00a0 We\u2019re also doing that bilaterally between the United States and Germany.\u00a0 There are other fora in which this is done.\u00a0 This is actually an important part of the work of the OECD, increasingly, something that I think is being re-energized at a really important time.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>I\u2019ll just move ahead to the next question so we can cover a little more.\u00a0 Martin van der Puetten has a question.<\/p>\n

QUESTION:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Good afternoon. My name is Martin van der Puetten and I\u2019m the director of international relations of the city of Dortmund, close to M\u00fcnster.\u00a0 It is a question that touches urban diplomacy, the subnational diplomacy topic.\u00a0 So my question is how do you intend to involve the city level \u2013 I do not mean the civil society; I mean the civil administrations, the city administrations \u2013 more systematically in your policy strategies,\u00a0e.g.,<\/em>\u00a0the China\u2019s strategy, the rebuild Ukraine strategy, and the climate foreign policy strategy?\u00a0 So my request is please use the power of the cities as a strategic tool in foreign policy.\u00a0 Thank you very much.<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Let me just say quickly to that I couldn\u2019t agree with you more.\u00a0 One of the things that we\u2019ve done \u2013 I just had the joy of naming someone to be at the State Department our senior official for subnational relations, because increasingly we found that we\u2019re working directly with cities, with municipalities, with regions, not just with our counterparts in national governments.<\/p>\n

And for a whole variety of reasons that you know very well from what you\u2019re doing every single day, cities are often the laboratories where all of these things are playing out and we get a chance to test out ideas and their application, including with things in the digital space.\u00a0 So that\u2019s incredibly powerful.\u00a0 It\u2019s also very powerful because at times when national governments, for one reason or another, as we would say colloquially, can\u2019t get their act together, it may well be that city, states, regions do.\u00a0 And so that\u2019s increasingly vital, too.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Would you like to add to that or \u2014<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Yeah, well, first of all, thanks for your question, but also thanks for participating in our national security strategy, because this was also for the first time why we are drafting it right now.\u00a0 I did a tour in summer through Germany.\u00a0 Many people asked why is the foreign minister doing a tour in Germany.\u00a0 But because obviously security matters are also security matters touching \u2013 and we see it again with Ukraine \u2013 but touching the daily life, and in many cities \u2013 we were just discussing what you have been saying \u2013 with regard to our infrastructure, with regard to data protection.\u00a0 Well, it doesn\u2019t help if we have the great ideas in foreign ministry, but in the town hall of D\u00fcsseldorf or Dortmund or somewhere else, even smaller cities, we have the next cyber attack.<\/p>\n

So therefore, we are integrating now in our national security strategy the cooperation with infrastructure.\u00a0 And now we are discussing here \u2013 everybody knows this \u2013 about China investment, for example.\u00a0 Again, they are not investing into our ministry in Berlin main town, but they are investing all over the countries.\u00a0 Also the question of cooperation between universities in other countries.\u00a0 So I think this is something which we are already on a good strike, but obviously we can intensify it even more.<\/p>\n

And again, also on the other parts when we go outside, when I traveled to other countries, and my credo is always I don\u2019t want to only meet foreign ministers, even though I like many of them a lot, but also go to school classes to hear what the people are saying, and to go to towns.\u00a0 When I was in Bosnia and Herzegovina, I said, okay, I visit Sarajevo but I would like to have also meeting with the mayors of two other cities.\u00a0 And it was not by coincidence that those mayors were way younger than those partners I met on the federal level, fighting for 30 years already the same fight.\u00a0 The mayors of these three towns from different ethnic backgrounds met for the first time, because I said I can only meet all the three of you together, I don\u2019t have enough time, so it would be great if you could all come together, otherwise I can meet nobody.<\/p>\n

So this can be also like a small instrument of actually using foreign policy totally different if you go to a different level segment.\u00a0 And again, also giving then power to different people, different age, different gender, different religion.\u00a0 So this is why I would also play the ball back to you because you\u2019re employed by a city.\u00a0 We have had back in time, thanks to the U.S. and other allies after the Second World War, the understanding of (inaudible) partnership from cities and from sports clubs.\u00a0 And we all traveled then to France and somewhere else to have this friendship.<\/p>\n

I think, even in a digitalized world, this is something, again, which we should intensify, as Tony was saying, the cooperation between cities, between region.\u00a0 When we saw in the U.S. that the federal level was withdrawing from the climate talks on the federal level, we had between Baden-W\u00fcrttemberg and California this under-two-degree coalition, and this is something we can build in every policy field.\u00a0 So I would like to invite everybody here also in the different institution in the different organization to intensify the discussion you were just mentioning.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>All right.\u00a0 If we keep it brief, we have \u2013 because I know you have a tight schedule for the rest of the day \u2013 we have room for one more question.\u00a0 Alexandrea Swanson, please.<\/p>\n

QUESTION:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Thank you so much.\u00a0 Honored to be here.\u00a0 My name is Alexandrea Swanson, also an \u2013 no, a U.S. citizen based in Berlin.\u00a0 I work at the Federation of German Industry, digitalization innovation department, where I lead an initiative called SheTransformsIT.\u00a0 And my question is \u2013 is going back to the topic of a feminist foreign policy.\u00a0 So Minister Baerbock, you mentioned this briefly at the beginning, and I would be interested to know \u2013 so we know that you\u2019ve implemented this in Germany for the first time.\u00a0 What is that looking like since the implementation?\u00a0 And Secretary Blinken, are there any discussions about implementing this at the U.S. Department of State?\u00a0 Thank you.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>You each have a minute.\u00a0 (Laughter.)<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>Well, the strategy is so long and then people always say, well, and she doesn\u2019t explain the whole strategy.\u00a0 Well, it\u2019s about rights, resources, and representation.\u00a0 And I just stick it to the point.\u00a0 Representation here because I think it\u2019s always totally underestimated.\u00a0 It doesn\u2019t make a difference only if, after 150 years, you have the first female foreign minister.\u00a0 And Tony suffers under this question because we had a time at G7 while there are many elections in between where there was a majority of women.\u00a0 Anyhow, I\u2019ve been asked \u2014<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>It was very hard.\u00a0 (Laughter.)<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong>\u00a0\u2014 a couple of weeks \u2013 because he wasn\u2019t allowed on the women\u2019s picture, so \u2013 (laughter).\u00a0 But anyhow, a couple of weeks ago I was asked whether I felt well in this group of men, and I said: well, just look at the picture; this is no group of men.\u00a0 But it\u2019s no coincident that they are two female ambassadors sitting here at the front row.\u00a0 So behind our representation issues on different parts, it is something also which touches our own ministry, where we can make the biggest difference.\u00a0 It\u2019s my decision who I send as the most important ambassadors to the most important capitals in the world.\u00a0 I can decide who I send there and who I don\u2019t send there, so I think it\u2019s many, many policy fields with regard to rights \u2013 Iran, women\u2019s right; with regard to Afghanistan and all these kind of things.<\/p>\n

But at the end, it come always back to yourself and your own ministry, and I think there we can do many things, and again, there\u2019s room for improvement.\u00a0 So Tony was doing the advertisement for the IT experts.\u00a0 I do the advertisement for female future generation wanting to serve in the foreign ministry office.\u00a0 You\u2019re more than welcome.\u00a0 (Applause.)<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 And I can only applaud that and tell you that it\u2019s very much part of our focus back home.\u00a0 And actually I think where we\u2019ve made the most progress at the State Department in recent years is having the senior ranks with women in leadership roles. \u00a0That\u2019s the case right now, where the deputy secretary of state, our representatives to the United Nations are well known to everyone; under secretary for political affairs, who\u2019s here with us as well, Toria Nuland, one of the leaders of our foreign policy.<\/p>\n

But let me just broaden this out very, very quickly.\u00a0 One of the things that I\u2019m engaged in is trying to make sure that we have a State Department that actually reflects the country that we represent, and that, of course, starts with women, but it doesn\u2019t end there.\u00a0 One of the challenges that we\u2019ve had is not having such a department over many, many decades.\u00a0 And I won\u2019t go into the details because time doesn\u2019t allow it, but I\u2019m determined that we get there in having a truly more representative department.<\/p>\n

And this is not because it is simply the right thing to do.\u00a0 It\u2019s because it\u2019s the smart and necessary thing to do.\u00a0 One of the great strengths that the United States brings to anything it does is our diversity, and we\u2019re operating when it comes to foreign policy by definition in a diverse world.\u00a0 If we are not bringing everyone to the table in our own department, in our own deliberations \u2013 if we\u2019re not bringing their different ideas, perspectives, experiences, knowledge to the table \u2013 we\u2019re shortchanging everything we do, and we\u2019re penalizing our ability to act effectively in a diverse world.\u00a0 So, of course, it starts with women, but it also includes all of the groups that are part of our society who need to be represented in, and acting on, and leading our foreign policy.\u00a0 Otherwise we\u2019re actually not doing a service to our own country.<\/p>\n

QUESTION:<\/strong>\u00a0 Iran women \u2013 can you say just two words on what you guys are doing or talking about to support the women of Iran?<\/p>\n

FOREIGN MINISTER BAERBOCK:<\/strong>\u00a0 Well, this is also one of the main topics at our G7 meeting.\u00a0 This sounds, \u201cwell, this is just one of the topics,\u201d but this is something special, because these kind of G7 meetings are normally having a long-time agenda and are targeting the issues with regard to economic development.\u00a0 So this is really a moment saying we bring up a human rights issue, we bring up a issue of democracy and freedom at this G7 meeting to coordinate the different bilateral actions we are doing, because we are running out of time.\u00a0 And German public knows this \u2013 I have been publishing last week a new proposal of four dimensions how we can support the women of Iran, and it\u2019s not only \u2013 Tony was mentioning it \u2013 it\u2019s not only women, it\u2019s like the diversity of the Iran society is saying, well, this is enough and we want to live in freedom like every \u2013 many other countries.\u00a0 So this is what we are doing here at G7, bringing together our support for the people of Iran with regard to sanctions, with regard to giving shelter for those who have high protection, but also with regard to bringing these atrocities to the UN system, to the UN bodies, because this is not automatically there.<\/p>\n

Again, as democratic states, we need majorities not only in our own countries but we need also majorities in UN bodies on human rights violations.\u00a0 And everybody in this room knows, I think, how hard it is, but if it\u2019s not the leading democratic economic powers who are ready to also go into this fight saying we don\u2019t have a majority automatically in a human rights body, but we fight for it, I think we shouldn\u2019t speak about democracies.\u00a0 And this is, again, why I\u2019m so thankful that we are working so close also on the question of supporting the people in Iran.<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 And only one very quick footnote:\u00a0 Also, with regard to technology, one of the things that we\u2019re trying to do together is to make sure that Iranians have the ability to communicate with each other and with the outside world.\u00a0 And technology is at the heart of that, making sure that there are no barriers to the extent we have anything to say about it to that technology getting to people who need it and want to use it.\u00a0 That\u2019s also part of the work we\u2019re doing.<\/p>\n

MR ZAMPERONI:<\/strong>\u00a0 Great closing statements, and I\u2019m happy to announce, Mr. Secretary, that you\u2019ll be able to be in this picture that\u2019s coming up now, so \u2014<\/p>\n

SECRETARY BLINKEN:<\/strong>\u00a0 Very good.\u00a0 Thank you.\u00a0 (Applause.)<\/p>\n<\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

11\/03\/2022 12:40 PM EDT   Antony...<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[7,5],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-54136","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-u-s-a","category-world"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/54136","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=54136"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/54136\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":54137,"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/54136\/revisions\/54137"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=54136"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=54136"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/lapost.us\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=54136"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}